Sheryl Sandberg and Adam Grant Interview on ‘Option B’ Book

Name: Sheryl Sandberg and Adam Grant Interview on ‘Option B’ Book
Uploaded: 2017-05-31T16:57:21.000Z
Duration: 1 h 50 min 57 s

Introduction and Background

The speaker expresses gratitude for the opportunity to be present and shares a personal anecdote about discovering the TED talk of Sheryl Sandberg. The impact of Sandberg's talk on women leadership is highlighted.

In 2010, the speaker received a TED talk from one of their MBA students but initially ignored it. However, after receiving multiple emails recommending the same talk, they decided to watch it.

The speaker found Sandberg's talk inspiring as she discussed women leaders and used similar studies that were taught in their own classroom.

Many students expressed admiration for Sandberg and wanted to follow in her footsteps.

The speaker noticed that when asked about admired leaders, only Sandberg's name was mentioned among numerous male leaders.

A sentence from Sandberg's book "Lean In" resonated with the speaker, further solidifying their admiration for her.

Option B, Resilience, and Women Leadership

The discussion will focus on resilience (Option B) and women leadership (Lean In). The speaker acknowledges Dave Goldberg for introducing them to Sheryl Sandberg.

Dave Goldberg introduced the speaker to Sheryl Sandberg, which they consider one of the greatest gifts they have received.

The speaker expresses gratitude towards Adam Grant for providing an opportunity to speak at his institution.

They mention meeting Dave in 1996 after graduating from business school and moving to LA. Initially friends, they eventually started dating and got married.

Dave was described as brilliant with unique perspectives but always respectful of others' opinions.

Despite playing April Fool's jokes on the speaker frequently, Dave was a great father and friend.

Dealing with Tragedy and Grief

The speaker discusses the sudden loss of Dave Goldberg and the overwhelming experience of grief.

Dave's sudden death came as a shock, and the speaker had to inform their children, who were 7 and 10 years old at the time.

Grief was described as an overwhelming void that closed in on the speaker, similar to a boot pushing on their chest.

The speaker reflects on how they were unprepared for such tragedy and emphasizes the importance of supporting others through diversity and hardship.

This summary covers only a portion of the transcript.

New Section

In this section, the speaker discusses how they were comforted by Adam's summary of research on helping children through difficult situations.

Comfort in Research Summary

Adam provided a comforting approach by summarizing research on helping children through divorce or loss.

The speaker realized that asking how to get their kids through the situation was the right question, but they were focusing on the wrong aspect of resilience.

Instead of questioning their and their kids' resilience, Adam emphasized building resilience as a muscle.

The speaker found solace in knowing that there are steps they can take based on researched strategies.

This understanding led to the formation of Option B org and writing "Option B."

New Section

In this section, the speaker discusses the three psychological traps mentioned by Adam: personalization, pervasiveness, and permanence.

Psychological Traps

The speaker initially questioned why psychologists have three concepts starting with the same letter but later understood their significance.

Personalization refers to blaming oneself for a situation. The speaker blamed themselves for their spouse's death and inconveniencing others.

Pervasiveness is when one believes that everything in life is affected negatively. The speaker felt that everything in their life was a disaster.

Permanence refers to feeling like things will never change. The speaker struggled with this feeling after their loss.

New Section

In this section, the importance of self-compassion and forgiveness is discussed.

Self-Compassion and Forgiveness

Adam emphasized the importance of self-compassion for recovery, not just forgiving oneself when it wasn't one's fault.

The formation of Option B org aimed to promote self-compassion and provide support for those who need forgiveness after tragedies.

Self-compassion involves speaking to oneself as one would to a friend, being kind and understanding.

Both men and women tend to speak more negatively to themselves than they would to a friend.

New Section

In this section, the speaker elaborates on the psychological traps mentioned earlier: personalization, pervasiveness, and permanence.

Psychological Traps (Continued)

Personalization involves blaming oneself for a situation. The speaker blamed themselves for their spouse's death and inconveniencing others.

Pervasiveness is when one believes that everything in life is affected negatively. The speaker felt that everything in their life was a disaster.

Permanence refers to feeling like things will never change. The speaker struggled with this feeling after their loss.

Timestamps are not available for the remaining part of the transcript provided.

The Importance of Knowing Traps and Applying Lessons

In this section, the speaker emphasizes the importance of recognizing traps and learning from past experiences to avoid them. They share personal anecdotes about their own experiences in college and early career, highlighting the value of gaining knowledge and skills.

Recognizing Traps and Learning from Past Experiences

It is crucial for individuals to be aware of traps so they can help themselves and others navigate through them.

The speaker reflects on their college days and wishes they had known certain lessons back then.

Personal anecdote: On their first day of work after college, they were asked to use a spreadsheet program they were unfamiliar with. This experience taught them the importance of acquiring relevant skills.

Despite initial challenges, the speaker learned from their mistakes and improved their spreadsheet skills.

Another personal anecdote: Going through a divorce at a young age made the speaker feel like a failure. However, applying lessons learned helped them overcome this hardship.

Imagining Alternative Paths and Gratitude

This section explores the concept of imagining alternative paths in life and how it can lead to gratitude. The speaker shares an example from their own life where reframing a situation helped them appreciate what they still had.

Imagining Alternative Paths Leads to Gratitude

After experiencing a significant loss, it was suggested to imagine how things could have been worse.

Initially skeptical, the speaker realized that considering worse scenarios allowed them to appreciate what they still had.

Personal anecdote: Losing a spouse suddenly made the speaker realize that their children being alive was something to be grateful for.

Thinking about what could have been worse helps individuals see the positives in their lives and fosters gratitude.

Despite lingering sadness or grief, going through hardships can make individuals more grateful for the gift of life itself.

Appreciating Life and Avoiding Age Jokes

This section focuses on appreciating life and avoiding age-related jokes. The speaker emphasizes the importance of gratitude and cherishing each birthday as a gift.

Appreciating Life and Cherishing Birthdays

The speaker reflects on their own journey and how they have become more grateful over time.

They express gratitude for reaching milestones like turning 48, which they previously took for granted.

Personal anecdote: The speaker advises against making jokes about getting old, as it diminishes the value of each birthday.

Appreciating life is about recognizing that growing older is a gift, rather than something to be feared or joked about.

Privilege and Resources in Resilience

This section discusses the role of privilege and resources in resilience. The speaker acknowledges their own privileges while highlighting the importance of resources in overcoming trauma.

Privilege, Resources, and Overcoming Trauma

The speaker acknowledges their own privileges compared to others who face severe hardships.

Resilience research initially focused on disadvantaged groups to understand how some individuals overcome trauma.

Personal reflection: Despite personal challenges, the speaker recognizes the significance of having resources available.

Consideration is given to those who go through similar traumas but lack essential resources such as housing or employment.

Public policy shortcomings are highlighted, particularly regarding single mothers facing difficult choices between work and caring for sick children.

Pre-Traumatic Growth and Comparing Resources

This section explores pre-traumatic growth and comparing available resources. The speaker contemplates what it would be like for others going through similar traumas with fewer resources.

Pre-Traumatic Growth and Resource Comparison

Pre-traumatic growth is discussed as a concept where individuals can emerge stronger from hardships.

The speaker and their collaborator have contemplated the experiences of others facing trauma with fewer resources.

Personal reflection: Despite personal challenges, the speaker acknowledges their own luck and privileges.

The importance of recognizing the role of resources in resilience is emphasized, particularly in societal contexts with inadequate support systems.

The transcript provided does not cover the entire video.

Collective Resilience

The speaker discusses the concept of collective resilience and the importance of having supportive relationships during difficult times. They mention programs like the Nurse Family Partnership that work with underprivileged families to build resilience. It is emphasized that preventing hardship and supporting individuals in rebuilding their lives is a societal responsibility.

Building Collective Resilience

Collective resilience is fostered through strong emotional support from friends who can process and summarize information, as well as provide comfort.

Programs like the Nurse Family Partnership have shown significant positive outcomes in reducing incarceration rates and other hardships for underprivileged families.

Society has a responsibility to prevent hardship by addressing issues such as racism, disadvantage, and poverty.

Public policy, corporate policy, and education on building collective resilience are essential in supporting those who are suffering.

Being a Supportive Friend

The speaker reflects on their experience of receiving unsupportive comments after facing loss and shares insights on how to be a good friend during difficult times. They emphasize the importance of acknowledging someone's suffering and offering support without burdening them with decision-making.

Learning to Be a Supportive Friend

It is important to acknowledge someone's suffering even if they don't want to talk about it at that moment.

Instead of saying "let me know if there's anything I can do," take initiative by doing something specific for them.

Small gestures like buying a stuffed animal for a child in the hospital or showing up with food can make a significant impact.

Being someone's best friend is not necessary to offer support; asking how you can help is always appropriate.

Finding Joy Post-Loss

The speaker discusses their journey towards finding joy after experiencing loss. They highlight that finding joy takes effort and is a discipline, especially in the context of grief.

Finding Joy Post-Loss

Despite initially believing they would never experience pure joy again, the speaker embarked on a search for joy.

Finding joy requires work and discipline, particularly after experiencing loss or grief.

The transcript provided does not contain enough content to create additional sections.

Finding Permission to Be Happy

In this section, the speaker discusses her struggle with guilt and permission to be happy after experiencing grief. She shares a conversation with her brother-in-law that gives her the permission she needed to find happiness for herself and her children.

Giving Yourself Permission

The speaker reflects on feeling guilty about being happy after experiencing grief.

Her brother-in-law calls and tells her that all her late husband ever wanted was for her and their children to be happy.

This conversation gives the speaker the permission she needed to allow herself to be happy.

She had already given this permission to her children but hadn't done so for herself.

Redefining Happiness

In this section, the speaker explores the concept of happiness and how it is often associated with big achievements or milestones. She learns from a friend that happiness can also be found in daily activities and small moments.

Rethinking Happiness

The speaker realizes that she had been associating happiness with big accomplishments like getting into prestigious schools or having a successful career.

Her friend Adam suggests that happiness can also be found in everyday activities and small moments.

The speaker starts engaging in activities that remind her of her late husband, such as playing games they used to play together or watching TV shows they enjoyed.

She also starts writing down three moments of joy before going to bed, which helps her focus on the positive aspects of each day.

Rediscovering Joy

In this section, the speaker talks about reclaiming activities that brought joy into her life before experiencing grief. She shares how she started playing games again, watching TV shows, and noticing small moments of joy throughout the day.

Taking Things Back

The speaker takes back activities that used to bring joy into her life, even though they reminded her of her late husband.

She starts playing games like Settlers of Catan with her children, even though she used to play it with her husband.

The speaker also resumes watching TV shows, despite the initial pain of reminders.

She mentions Game of Thrones and Scrabble as examples.

Noticing Moments of Joy

The speaker follows Adam's suggestion to write down three moments of joy before going to bed.

By actively looking for these moments, she becomes more aware of them throughout the day.

Examples include having a cup of coffee, someone telling a joke, or receiving an unexpected hug from her son.

Rebuilding Self-Confidence

In this section, the speaker discusses how grief affected her self-confidence. She shares her previous work on promoting self-confidence and how she struggled with it after experiencing loss.

Confidence Shattered by Grief

The speaker had previously worked on promoting self-confidence through writing and giving advice.

However, after experiencing grief, particularly the death of her husband Dave, her self-confidence was shattered.

She reflects on how grief impacted her ability to focus at work and contribute during meetings.

Mark Zuckerberg's Support

The speaker mentions Mark Zuckerberg's support during this challenging time.

Instead of offering time off or understanding due to personal circumstances, he reassured her that making mistakes was understandable given the situation.

This support provided comfort and helped alleviate some fears about losing everything.

Overcoming Lack of Confidence

In this section, the speaker talks about overcoming a lack of confidence after experiencing grief. She reflects on societal differences in self-confidence between men and women and how she had previously worked on building confidence in herself and others.

Gender Differences in Confidence

The speaker acknowledges that women often feel less self-confident than men, based on data and personal experiences.

She had previously worked on correcting this gender disparity through her writing and advice.

Grief's Impact on Self-Confidence

The speaker shares how the death of her husband Dave significantly impacted her self-confidence.

Mothering two grieving children alone while trying to navigate work responsibilities became overwhelming.

She struggled to focus during meetings and feared losing everything.

Mark Zuckerberg's Reassurance

Mark Zuckerberg's understanding and reassurance that she would have made mistakes even before the loss provided comfort.

This support helped alleviate some of the speaker's fears about her ability to perform at work.

Conclusion

In this section, the speaker concludes by emphasizing the importance of giving oneself permission to be happy and rebuilding self-confidence after experiencing grief.

Finding Joy Amidst Grief

The speaker acknowledges that joy can coexist with grief, although it may not be present in every moment.

By giving herself permission to be happy and focusing on small moments of joy, she has been able to find happiness again.

Rebuilding Confidence

The speaker reflects on how grief affected her self-confidence but also highlights the importance of support from others, such as Mark Zuckerberg.

She emphasizes the need for individuals to give themselves permission and provide themselves with tools for rebuilding confidence.

Timestamps are approximate.

Supporting Others through Trauma and Loss

In this section, the speaker discusses the importance of supporting others through trauma, tragedy, and loss. They emphasize the significance of comforting and holding people as they cry, showing up for them in difficult times, and also building them back up by complimenting their strengths.

How to Support Women More Effectively

Building a personal brand is not necessary. Products are marketed with packaging, but people are not that simple. Instead of focusing on building a personal brand, it is important to have an authentic voice.

Speak honestly and from your experience. Use data to support your statements.

Avoid asserting things that aren't true.

Be clear about the differences between having a voice and having a brand.

Mentorship for Women

Women often ask for mentorship more frequently than men do.

Asking someone to be your mentor without knowing them well is ineffective. Building relationships with mentors should happen organically through working together.

Personal board of directors concept is flawed. You're not a company or a product that needs a board of directors.

Peer mentorship can be just as important as traditional mentorship. Lean In circles or similar programs can provide opportunities for peer mentoring.

Changing Perspectives on Mentorship

In this section, the speaker discusses the need for change in how women seek mentorship. They highlight the difference in approaches between women and men when asking for mentorship or seeking personal board members.

Seeking Mentorship

Women often ask strangers to be their mentors, while men rarely do so.

It's more effective to build relationships with mentors through organic connections at work rather than asking someone you don't know well to be your mentor.

Asking someone if you can solve their problem instead of asking them to be on your personal board of directors can lead to more meaningful mentorship opportunities.

The Power of Peer Mentorship

Peer mentorship can be just as valuable as traditional mentorship.

Lean In circles and similar programs provide opportunities for peer mentoring.

Peers can offer valuable insights and support in career decisions.

Importance of Peer Mentorship

In this section, the speaker emphasizes the importance of peer mentorship and shares personal experiences. They highlight how peers can provide guidance and advice when making career decisions.

The Value of Peers

Peers who have experienced similar career paths or faced similar challenges can offer valuable advice and guidance.

Personal connections with peers who have different perspectives can help solve problems and make better decisions.

Joining groups like Lean In circles or other programs can facilitate peer mentorship opportunities.

This summary is based on the provided transcript.

The Importance of Case Studies in Education

In this section, the speaker discusses the value of case studies in education and how they can improve the learning experience.

Benefits of Case Studies

Case studies offer a more practical and engaging approach to learning compared to generic options.

Generic offers, such as option B, are not as effective as case studies in enhancing the educational experience.

The speaker believes that case studies can greatly improve classroom dynamics and make classes more interesting.

Suggestions for Improvement

After attending a lecture, the speaker suggests talking to five people to gather feedback on how it could be better.

The speaker offers three ways to enhance the lecture experience and is willing to write them up for further discussion.

Proposing projects or surveys as class activities can also contribute to a better learning environment.

Taking Initiative

The speaker encourages taking initiative by suggesting improvements or offering assistance with projects or surveys.

By actively participating and contributing ideas, students can help create a more collaborative and supportive atmosphere.

Women Supporting Each Other

This section focuses on dispelling the myth that women do not support each other. The speaker highlights historical challenges faced by women but emphasizes the importance of women helping one another.

Historical Challenges

Historically, there was limited room for promotion for women due to their underrepresentation.

The "queen bee syndrome" refers to situations where women were pitted against each other for limited opportunities.

Women Helping Women

Women often receive less credit for their ideas and work compared to men.

Supporting and giving credit to fellow women can create a win-win situation where everyone benefits.

Pointing out biases through collective action helps address gender disparities in various settings, including classrooms.

Overcoming Bias and Creating Opportunities

This section addresses biases faced by women and the misconception that bias no longer exists. The speaker emphasizes the need to recognize biases and create equal opportunities for all.

Biases Faced by Women

Women face biases in terms of receiving credit for their work and ideas.

Men often receive more promotions than women, even with similar qualifications and tenure.

The speaker highlights the importance of acknowledging these biases and calling them out.

Zero-Sum Situations

Some individuals believe that efforts towards diversity disadvantage men.

The speaker counters this argument by presenting data that supports the existence of biases against women.

It is crucial to understand that biases are real and need to be addressed for a fairer society.

Recognizing Gender Biases

In this section, the speaker discusses gender biases and how they affect perceptions of confidence, leadership, and opportunities.

Perception of Confidence

Men are often perceived as confident as they gain power, while women may be liked less as they become more powerful.

Resumes with white-sounding names receive significantly more callbacks compared to those with black-sounding names.

These biases highlight the challenges faced by women in various aspects of life.

Addressing Biases

Blind auditions in orchestras have led to increased representation of women musicians who were previously overlooked due to gender bias.

It is important to acknowledge these biases exist and take steps to address them for a fairer society.

Due to limitations in available content, some sections may not have been covered in this summary.

The Importance of Gender Equality

In this section, the speaker discusses the benefits of achieving gender equality and emphasizes that it is not a zero-sum game. Economic growth, productivity, company performance, and children's well-being are all positively impacted by gender equality.

The Value of Long-Term Dreams and Ambition

Many students ask about their long-term career plans, but the speaker advises against mapping out a rigid 12 or 15-year path.

Having a long-term dream is important, especially for women and underrepresented minorities.

Performance of minorities and women is often underestimated compared to white men.

Being ambitious doesn't necessarily mean aiming for CEO positions; it means making a difference in the world and living your dreams.

It's crucial to think about what you would do if you weren't afraid and take steps towards that goal within the next year or two.

Building Skills and Embracing Failure

Mapping out your career should focus on skills development rather than just building a perfect resume.

Embrace failure and take on challenges that may seem beyond your current capabilities.

Avoid connecting short-term plans too closely with long-term dreams as opportunities may arise that were previously unforeseen.

Defining Friendship

In this section, the speaker reflects on friendship and how Facebook has redefined the concept. They discuss what defines a friend and emphasize the importance of having people who genuinely care about you.

The Definition of Friendship

Friendship is defined as someone who has your best interests at heart, supports you during difficult times, and celebrates your successes.

The speaker doesn't have a specific term for those in-between friends and colleagues or acquaintances.

The Value of Friends

Having friends who care about you and whom you can keep in touch with throughout your life is incredibly special.

The speaker shares their experience of collaborating with Adam on writing projects, highlighting the importance of strong collaborations.

Writing Option B

In this section, the speaker discusses the process of writing "Option B" and reflects on their collaboration with Adam. They mention that the book consists of personal stories, research, and experiences from various individuals who have faced adversity.

Collaborative Writing Process

The collaboration between the speaker and Adam was one of the best in their career.

"Option B" includes personal stories from the speaker's journal entries, research conducted by Adam, and inspiring stories from others who have overcome challenges.

Writing the Book

In this section, the speaker discusses the process of writing their book and how it was a collaborative effort. They also mention the challenges faced in finding the right narrative voice.

The book was written by both speakers, but they initially started writing it together as "we". However, they realized that it didn't read well because most of it was one person's story.

They had to use first-person singular for that part, which felt a little weird but there was no other way to do it.

Reflecting on College and Business School

The speaker reflects on their college and business school experience and shares insights on what they would have done differently.

The writing process of the book was enjoyable for the speaker.

If given a chance, they would have approached college and business school differently.

The speaker emphasizes that many things they worried about during their academic years turned out to be less important in the long run.

Grades and extracurricular activities may not have as much impact on one's career as initially believed.

Gaining Perspective

The speaker talks about gaining perspective in life and highlights how some things that seem significant at the moment may not hold much importance in the grand scheme of things.

The speaker shares an anecdote about their son's basketball team losing a game. While his friends were upset, he had a different perspective because he understood that there are bigger challenges in life.

Students are encouraged to gain perspective and not overly stress about minor things like grades or club positions.

It is emphasized that facing real-life challenges can provide valuable perspective and help prioritize what truly matters.

Enjoying What You Do

The speaker advises students to focus on doing what they enjoy and not to overly stress about future career prospects.

Students are reassured that being elected as the president of a club or achieving top grades may not have a significant impact on their future careers.

The speaker encourages students to pursue activities they genuinely enjoy, as it will enhance their skills and overall well-being.

It is mentioned that having perspective and enjoying the journey can lead to better outcomes in life.

Dealing with Challenges

The speaker reflects on how gaining perspective would have helped them deal with challenges during their academic years.

The speaker believes that students today seem more anxious compared to when they were in school.

They encourage students to realize that attending Wharton provides ample opportunities for success, and there is no need for excessive worry.

Gaining perspective would have helped the speaker understand and cope better with challenges faced during their academic years.

Wishes for the Audience

The speaker shares their wishes for the audience, emphasizing the importance of friendship, joy, and living life fully.

The speaker expresses gratitude towards a friend named Adam who redefined friendship for them by consistently showing up with support and love.

They wish for the audience to focus on what they care about, believe in themselves, and find joy in life.

Despite facing personal loss, the speaker emphasizes that there is always another day filled with laughter, coffee, and even tears.

Taking Risks

The speaker discusses taking risks in life and investing in oneself.

The speaker mentions how some people misunderstand investing in oneself as solely partying or indulging in leisure activities. However, it goes beyond that.

They pose a thought-provoking question: What would you do if you knew your time was limited?

Taking risks, pursuing real things, and living life to the fullest are encouraged.

Cherishing Friendship

The speaker expresses gratitude for a friend named Adam and highlights the impact of his friendship on their happiness.

The speaker considers Adam as a significant part of finding joy and happiness in life.

Adam's consistent support, love, and presence have made a profound difference.

The speaker acknowledges Adam's wife for her support as well.

Final Wishes

The speaker shares their final wishes for the audience, emphasizing the importance of living with less worry and more love and joy.

The speaker wishes that the audience focuses on what they care about, believes in themselves, and trusts that things will work out.

They share personal experiences of loss but emphasize that there is always another day filled with opportunities for laughter, coffee, and even tears.

The audience is encouraged to worry less, live more, love more, and find joy in life.

Reflection on Life's Fragility

The speaker reflects on the fragility of life and shares insights gained from personal experiences.

The speaker mentions losing their husband suddenly and how it made them realize that there is always another day to experience new things.

They encourage the audience to worry less, live more fully, love deeply, and seek more joy in life.

Investing in Yourself

The speaker discusses investing in oneself by doing meaningful things rather than just partying or indulging in leisure activities.

It is emphasized that investing in oneself means pursuing real things that bring fulfillment.

Katie Couric's statement during an interview resonates: "Everyone's terminal."

Final Thoughts

In closing remarks, the speaker shares final thoughts and wishes for the audience.

The speaker expresses admiration for Cheryl, who redefined what it means to be a giver.

They express gratitude for Cheryl's presence despite disappointing important family members by not coming to Penn.

The speaker wishes that the audience focuses on what they care about, believes in themselves, and lives with less worry and more love, joy, and insight.

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